Alaska's former top cop says he felt pressure to fire trooper
Originally published Saturday, July 19, 2008 at 12:10 p.m.
Updated Saturday, July 19, 2008 at 4:36 p.m.
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Stumble It!ANCHORAGE -- Former Department of Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan acknowledged that he felt pressure from administration officials and family members of Gov. Sarah Palin to fire a Palmer Alaska State Trooper involved in a bitter child custody battle with Palin's sister.
Monegan told the Anchorage Daily News that phone calls and questions from the Palin administration and the governor's husband, Todd Palin, about trooper Mike Wooten started shortly after Monegan was hired.
The governor also had a brief conversation with him about Wooten in February, Monegan said.
Monegan has been mostly silent about the reasons for his own sudden dismissal July 11. Monegan repeated that he still isn't sure why he was fired but thought that Wooten could be part of it.
"I don't know that it's all of it. ... I worked at the pleasure of the governor," he said.
Palin has strongly denied that Monegan's dismissal had anything to do with her former brother-in-law. She said she never pressured the commissioner to fire her sister's ex-husband and no one from her office had complained about Wooten.
Monegan said pressure came from those around Palin, including former Palin chief of staff Mike Tibbles, Department of Administration Commissioner Annette Kreitzer, and director of boards and commissions Frank Bailey.
Tibbles is now campaign manager for U.S. Sen. Ted Stevens. He said Friday he could not comment on whether he spoke to Monegan about Wooten.
Palin spokeswoman Sharon Leighow said Bailey never had such a conversation with Monegan.
Kreitzer could not recall, Leighow said.
Monegan never opened a new investigation into the allegations against Wooten.
"They weren't getting the message." Monegan said. "The fact that they tried for better than a year while I was there is kind of indicative that somebody was trying to pressure something. Because they were trying different venues and different people."
Todd Palin called a meeting with Monegan to talk about Wooten shortly after his wife took office in December 2006, Todd Palin said Friday.
Monegan said Todd Palin talked to him several times after that about Wooten. Todd Palin said he could not recall conversations with the commissioner about his ex-brother-in-law outside of the initial meeting.
"But I know I've never told him to fire trooper Wooten," Todd Palin said.
The meeting occurred in the governor's office with the governor absent, Monegan said.
Todd Palin showed Monegan the work of a private investigator the Palins hired. The Palins accused Wooten of drunken driving, illegal hunting and child abuse, among other charges.
The governor's husband said the family was concerned about the governor's safety. The Palins say Wooten threatened to kill Sarah Palin's father and made vague threats to her that he would "bring me down."
Monegan said he told Todd Palin that he would look into Wooten. Monegan, however, learned that allegations against Wooten already had been reviewed with an internal trooper investigation in 2005. Wooten was disciplined for illegally killing a moose and using a Taser stun gun on an 11-year-old family member.
In February, Monegan said, the governor brought up Wooten's name. They were walking together to wish Sen. Lyman Hoffman a happy birthday.
"I told her I needed to keep her at arm's distance and she shouldn't be involved," he said. "She said, 'OK, that's a good idea.'"
Bailey was the latest to contact him about Wooten, Monegan said. He called a trooper commander, and several others, before the calls ended up in Monegan's lap. Monegan called him back.
"'We can't do this. This is not what we are supposed to do,'" Monegan said he told Bailey.
Alaska lawmakers are discussing whether they should hire a special investigator to look into the circumstances surrounding Palin's firing of Monegan, according to the Anchorage Daily News.
Col. Audie Holloway, head of the troopers, on Friday said the governor never spoke to him about Wooten. Asked if anyone in the administration had, he said, "I can't answer that."
Todd Palin on Friday said he spoke to Holloway about Wooten after he saw Wooten on a snowmobile in April 2007. He gave Holloway a photo of Wooten on the machine, demonstrating what he thought was a violation of his Wooten's worker's compensation claim.
Troopers looked into it, Monegan said, and found that it probably occurred but was not something that warranted a dismissal.
Wooten remains employed as a trooper in Palmer. He and his ex-wife, Sarah Palin's sister Molly McCann, continue to have a troubled relationship since their divorce in 2005. A week ago, she called 911 because he would not hand over their young children to her, she said. She was scared, she said.
Monegan said he decided to speak after his week of silence because, "I'm watching the stresses put on everyone I used to work with. And, these guys are good people," he said. "This may be one of the few things, one of my last things, to support them.
"You know, they can't fire me twice."
Community Discussion
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BigMike, all that was said and done before Monegan was in office. Palin wanted a "do-over". She wanted to interfere with the day-to-day operation of the department, rallied all the forces against Monegan to get him to circumvent the process then lied about it.
She'll be investigated, then you'll hear the other side of the story. Wooten's not the issue at all, using the governor's office as a tool for personal gain is the issue.
If she had used her office to get rich, you'd be screaming, but it doesn't make any difference that she chose to grind an axe on a personal issue in the eyes of the statute.
I'd be disappointed if Palin did not act. We have a State Trooper who took a State issued Taser and shot his own kid with it- for fun. A Trooper who killed a moose illegally, and also was driving a Trooper car after drinking booze.
Oh yeah, he also allegedly threatened to kill a member of Sarah's family.
What would the public say if Sarah had not raised her concerns with DPS?
This trooper, he was tried and convicted by a jury, right? No? Then in the eyes of the law, he is innocent.
Should he be under investigation? Perhaps. Should he be summarily fired? Not without cause.
If you would take the time to read the documents published online about what really happened and educate yourself, you may see things in a different light.
First, regarding the tasing of his step son. The boy asked to be tased, because he wanted to know what it felt like. Wooten then used a training cartridge (which connects using clips, not by shooting probes, so he never "shot" the boy with it) and gave his son a one second jolt to let him know what it felt like. Not "for fun," not to punish him, and not to teach him a lesson, but to satisfy his natural curiosity about the tools officers carry at work. And while this was happening, the boy's mother (the future governor's sister) was standing right there and did not seem to mind. However, Wooten's use of the taser was found to be outside department policy (rightfully so in my opinion) and he was punished for it. Absolutely he used poor judgment, but not something criminal or worthy of being fired. And, none of this was brought to the attention of the department by Palin or her family until years later, during the child custody issue. If he was soooo bad, why wait until then to report it?
Second, regarding the shooting the moose illegally: Wooten's wife Molly (again same sister of the governor) had a permit to shoot a moose. When the time came, she couldn't pull the trigger, so Wooten shot it for her with her standing next to him. Her (and the future governor's) dad then helped get the moose back to the dad's house, where he helped butcher the moose. The meat was then shared with the entire family, including Sarah and Todd, who knew exactly what circumstances the moose had been taken under. And yet they took the meat, presumably ate the meat, and said nothing until years later when the custody battle began. (and I'm no expert in this field, but as the permit holder, didn't Molly have to sign the permit saying that she indeed had been the one that shot the moose?)
As far as him drinking, it was never alleged that he had done that on duty, but that he had stopped at a neighbor's house in his patrol car (not clear if it was on the way home from work, or if he had just picked up his car from the shop, etc.), had a beer, then drove his patrol car the rest of the way home (in the same subdivision). And as I recall, of the 36 (yes, 36!) different allegations brought against Wooten by Palin and her family, only three were substantiated, and this was not one of them. Sounds to me like they were flinging as much mud as they could in hopes of seeing what would stick. I'm not trying to defend Trooper Wooten, because I think his actions were shameful and have brought a bad name to all of the troopers, but at least he had the courage to let his entire record be made public so we could judge for ourselves. More than we can say about "open and transparent" Gov. Palin, who still has not provided us the voting public with what "new direction" she wants to take DPS.
All of these incidents happened, and were dealt with, before Palin was governor, and Monegan was commissioner, so why did Palin come into office, report these things to Monegan again, reportedly request that her former brother in law be fired, and then fire Monegan for refusing to do so (because the issues had already been dealt with.) And by firing Monegan, she has taken a step backwards, because Wooten is still a trooper, and Palin has a lot of explaining to do.
I don't know if we should be wasting our time on legislative hearings like Jay Ramras wants (does he ever think before he opens his mouth?). We are in the midst of a special session trying to make a decision about a gasline; instead some want to get sidetracked into this messy affair. Having said that, I do think the legislature should appoint an investigator to look into whether this was the reason Monegan was replaced and whether the power of the Governor's office is being used to settle a personal grievance. Governor Palin set the bar high when she declared that this would be an open and transparent administration; she urged Senator Ted Stevens to explain himself to the public over the FBI investigations; now she has to live up to the standards she set.
It will take time to investigate what actually happened; until then people should stop speculating and concentrate on the gasline! I know this irks a lot of people who want instant resolution (particular those who want to see Palin fall off the pedestal she's been placed on) but we need to get facts, not just hearsay. Even Mr. Monegan admits he doesn't know if this had anything to do with his termination.
Palin has no right to use her authority as governor for personal gain or to benefit a family member or friend - period. Lets see if Kopp kisses tail and fires Wooten.
BigMike, I've read through the transcripts - and the vast majority basically are nothing but second- and third- hand rumors. It worries the heck out of me that we have a governor who believes people should be arrested and convicted on innuendo, not a belief in the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" and proof. Also, our governor's word on a few things seems a bit shaky - for example, see the reasons she claimed she and her son were listening on the phone, and the reasons her son claimed they were listening on the phone.
Yes, I've seen cops protect their own in the past - and there are certainly plenty of the laughs, etc., in these transcripts that our troopers should be ashamed of. However, this is not about that - this is about the possible abuse of power by a sitting governor, and, ironically enough, trying to "protect her own". "Possible" is the important word - she deserves the same right of innocent until proven guilty as does her ex-brother-in-law. And her case should be investigated and reviewed just as thoroughly, if not more so.
If Kopp fires Wooten now, impeachment proceedings should begin the next day. No one, even a governor with a 90% approval rating, is above the law. Impeachment proceedings have started for lessor things in this state (see 1985, Gov. Sheffield and allegations of his attempt to steer a lease to a political supporter.)
"Chelly - you seem to know a lot more than what's in the transcripts. Because the details that you presented are not in the transcripts." -BigMike
Actually I dont think Chelly mentioned a single thing that wasnt in one of the three articles that ADN has published over the last few days. He/She cant help it if you ill-read on the subject.
What I find the most telling of this whole mess is the fact that Sarah was aware of what she preceived was a crime (illegal shooting of a moose), yet sat on, and presumably benifited (free meat) from, the crime and did not have a problem with it for quite some time. In fact she finally happen to notify the authorities only when it could benifit her sisters divorce and custody battle. In fact it seems she did not feel the need to report anything she preceived as wrong until her sisters marriage to Wooten fell apart.
All about "ethics", except when they get in the way of what she wants.
"Benefiting a family member = not letting them be killed?"
Ah, yes. She was sooooo worried about her sister and her kids that:
1. she stood in the driveway and watched her brother-in-law "in a rage...waving his arms around" and "freaking out" for 15 whole minutes,
2. while she "thought, 'He is going to blow it.' ...there's no other step for him to take next except from [sic] physical violence."
3. Then she decided that, if the situation turned violent, her sister or her nephew could call her on her cell or call 9-1-1,
4. so she asked a neighbor to watch the family through the window, because "it's looking dangerous,"
5. and she left to go to a meeting.
BigMike and any other Palin apologists out there, the quotes I used were from the transcript of Sarah's interview with Sergeant Ron Wall. Those are SARAH PALIN'S VERY OWN WORDS.
You know something, ladies and gentlemen? That is a very trashy family and an embarrassment to our state.
Having been in a difficult divorce in 2000 and been accused over and over of a variety of untrue allegations in order to damage my reputation for child custody purposes, I can understand the difficulties this can cause in one's personal life. The wasted time and resources of the judicial system of unhappy ex's is criminal and needs to be addressed. What a great opening for that forum.
Corey Allen, Candidate for State House-North Pole
I agree with big mike on most of this after reading all the transcripts. If one of us had tasered a kid or shot a moose on someone elses hunting tags we would of been charged. Look up Wootens court files so you can get a better picture of this guy. How many of you would not do every thing you can to protect your family. Sounds like they asked Monegan to look into the old complaints because they felt it had been covered up by the Troopers doing their own investigation and hoped a new face might follow through better and all he did is not look into it because it had been done already. If my boss asked me to check out something because they were not satisfied with how it was done by the guy before me I would do it and give them my opinion. It should not matter why she fired Monegan as she hired him and if she does not like the way he combs his hair on some days he works at her pleasure or not. I would be more upset at the Gov if she did not use every bit of her power to protect her family as would any of us. One of you taser your stepchild even if he asks for you to and see how long it takes for charges to be filed against you and the child put in State custody until you take all kinds of classes on alternatives to violence etc. I also find it interesting that the union is backing Monegan. If he is keeping the union happy and the Troopers he must not be doing his job correctly.
The issue isnt wether what the trooper did was right or wrong (the latter being true) the issue is that we have a check and balance within our system that does not give the governor the use of public offices for personal gain. If the trooper was taken to the authorities that govern over actions of police officers and they did not punish him enough I can feel for our gov and her sister. That frustration has been felt by numerous families that deal with these issues daily in our country and she just happens to be in a position to have been able to do something about that frustration, the question is does the governor have the authority to make decisions based of her personal sentiment over that of a jury of peers? I dont think that it should.
The saying "those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones seems appropriate to this imbroglio" With that said, calling them a trashy family is a pretty base statement. I think we're discovering that they pretty much mirror the rest of Alaskans, just human.
Most Alaska governor's while in office had problems with their children and family but much of it never came to print. Want some examples? I won't name names, but many folks who spent time in Juneau knew of these incidents.
One governor had the state troopers go out to find his wife, because she was out on the town. Another former governor had problems with his daughter drinking underage. Our first governor's son reportedly had a still in the mansion. These are but a few of the domestic issues all of we humans have from time to time. Folks people are human, we all have imperfections. I'm certain there were many more that have and will transpire in future administrations.
We have a very young governor in office. A mistake made was to try and put on the face veil of perfection. And that is where the trouble starts - that veil is a lie, we can't be perfect, only human. Honestly I knew something would come to light eventually and now it has.
I recall the blame laid on the former governor and anyone associated with him. There were many good people who were dismissed with guilt by association. And perhaps many judged as unsuitable for the present administration because of their past poor decisions. I knew that eventually the claim of transparency would catch up and present itself in public.
For anyone to get on their high horse for unlawful transgressions; I challenge you to take a look at your past poor decisions and perhaps consider withholding condemnation when you examine your own escapades - I know that I have to do that every time I think to condemn someone for their transgressions.
In the end, I hope the governor and her family learn a lesson in humility. Christ said in Luke 6: 41-42 "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take the speck out of your eye,' when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.
Having more than a decade of wisdom over the governor, it is understandable to me how this would happen. I hope that the issue is brought to full light and that a lesson is learned by all.
Like many others I have learned some important lessons is humility and they were good lessons which made me a much more rounded person. None of us is without redemption for our mistakes, it's whether we learn from them that is important.
I don't think Monegan could have fired Wooten for those incidents if he wanted to (which he may have wanted to do). By the time Monegan came on board, those incidents had occurred, been investigated, and punishment had been handed down. For Monegan to come in, reinvestigate and hand down a new punishment would have been a form of double jeopardy. I'm not saying I agree with the punishment Wooten got, but from a legal and HR point of view, I think Monegan's hands were pretty much tied. Whether he liked the rules or not, Mongegan still had to follow them.
A trashy family might contain a member that rode a bank into failure. Was elected to the senate then governor and used his position to appoint a family member to fill his vacancy in the senate.
FYI, I wasn't excusing any of the examples you just listed lakloey - just making a point about how we all can commit some horrible blunders and most importantly learn from them.
So here we have someone who "... was disciplined for illegally killing a moose and using a Taser stun gun on an 11-year-old family member." and possibly filing questionable worker's compensation claims, and DPS doesn't take action to terminate this guy?
Unbelievable.
To say this guy has poor judgment is an understatement. If you or I were to do anything close to this, look out! Why I love cops so much...
The governor is smart to keep quiet. Anybody who has ever run a business knows that when you fire someone you should not give a reason. She's doing fine. And the press needs to learn that they cannot create a scandal just because they disagree with her policies. People are smarter than that, and too busy to care about things which do not affect them.
The press would do better to illustrate and explain how the oil market affects us. The market does not serve individual Alaskans. It benefits the producers and the state at the expense of the people. Alaska should sell royalty oil and refined products to residents at below-market prices. The market is no longer tied to the cost of production, so the only cost is a reduction of the excessive profits. It would have a ripple effect through the whole economy by reducing the cost of groceries and building materials and everything else that must be transported.
There are good uses for ink and electrons. Trying to stir up the mud in a clear lake is not one of them.
This is a serious breach of ethics, to have a Governor's husband use the
powers of the State. And to represent the State against
other State employees. It sounds like the Governor's office was involved in
a smear campaign, to discredit the Dept of Public Safety Commissioner. Exactly
who is in charge of our State, the Governor or her husband, who appears to
be abusing her State power's. The Governor's husband used our Governor's
Office to conduct a meeting with the DPS Commissioner, an abuse of power?
What right does the Governor's husband have to use the executive branch
of our State Government, as his judicial whip, to beat our public servants?
People are beginning to say, who wants our State Government, the Governor
we elected or her husband? It sounds like her husband.
The guy is a jerk. Quit wasting our and the governor's time on it so we can get on with the important stuff! Especially energy! One guy lost a job. Without solving energy thousands will lose jobs. And the ridiculous statement of the year was the "trashy" one.
Lies, lies lies. "I can't recall..." I can't comment..." "I don't remember..."
BS.
Guy shot a kid with a taser how come the kid wasn't taken by dyfs?
For all of you that want Wooten's head on a platter, whether that is right or wrong, I don't think it is legally possible at this point. He has already been "sentenced" under a prior administration, and a new administration can't come in and "sentence" him to be fired. He would sue, win, get his job back, and the only thing we'd have to show for it would be less money in the general fund, and he'd still have his job. How does that help us? Read my earlier post on why I don't think he can be fired.
And if you'd read the documents posted online, you'd learn that he didn't "shoot" his son with a taser. He connected the wires from a training cartridge to his son at his son's request so he could see what it felt like and gave him a 1 second jolt. All while the kid's mom (governor's sister) was standing right there and seemed to have no problem with it. (until years later during a custody battle of course!) Poor judgment, but hardly one that rises to the level of criminality.
And to those that think tasers are so dangerous, please educate yourself. No jury (made of people like you and me) has ever found taser responsible for the death of anyone. Yes, people (who were high on drugs and had vigorously fought with the police while being taken into custody) who have been tased have died. But they were also wearing underwear. Does that mean that underwear can lead to death? In other words, there is no direct cause and effect. Tasers hurt. They don't kill. Check out taser.com for more info.
BigMike- Are you a Criminal or related to one? Because you sure act like it, with your ANTI-POLICE jargen and your justifications of Gov Palin! You are missing the point here. IT'S NOT ABOUT TROOPER WOOTEN!!!! He's allready been punished, YEARS AGO! Got it Now. Do not judge all troopers or Police officers on what 1 does. It's simply not fair of you. Why dont you try supportng them instead of dissing them.
What it is about, is Gov Palin, her husband, & her other cronies abusing HER power to get someone (wooten) fired. All of the stuff happened YEARS AGO and she fired Montigan now YEARS later for not obeying her.
This is all imagination. No need to get so worked up about any of it. Let it got. Live a happy life. Don't look for problems. In fact, it takes hard work to look for reasons to be happy.
If any of us had made the claims against the trooper and alleged white washing of his record do you think we would have gotten any results? If the governor asks for a review, whether for her own knowledge or on behalf of the people, shouldn't she get results. It looks suspicious that she is a relative who thinks something about the case didn't make sense and asked for a review. The only questionable part about asking for a formal review is that she is or was personally aware of the case prior to being elected.
She did ask for the initial review in which he was vindicated from all but three incidents by his peers and I for one applaud her for uncovering a cover-up by the troopers and DPS. Illegal activity is illegal and no-one is above the law. A public hearing should have been conducted on the trooper's case, not some behind closed doors cover-up.
She gave the guy a chance to blow the cover-up and fix the issue. He contributed to the cover-up, rather than ascerting his position and providing strong ethical leadership. I think we need a formal review of every trooper's record to ensure we have a good non-hypocritical force enforcing the law.
As for tasing a kid, that is not good even with training cartridges so says the report. The excuse that the kid wanted to know how it felt to be tased is poor. Those training cartridges are meant for adults not kids. It is our responsibility as adults to teach kids right from wrong and just because they want to know what it feels like to get gun shot, doesn't meant we shoot them. That's when a trooper would show up and take me or any parent to jail.
What did we pay this guy and train him for so long to be? Where did that training get messed up that he thinks it's ok to do what he did? Where does the system allow someone to keep their job with the department of public safety while disregarding the safety of a child. Is this a department wide problem or just an isolated incident?
As a proud Alaskan I fully support Gov. Palin, She is cleaning up all the corrupt. Ok I understand all you people that think she is abusing her power, but she is more the less in concern of her well being and the well being of her family, how can you give a man that illegally uses his taser, there are many people around this country that have died off of tases. This man does it to his 10 year old son. 1) 38% of americans that have been tased have died. 2) A child isnt suppose to be tased unless it is life threatning (my brother is a cop and given me this information) Im all with big mike. The man is smart and knows what he is talking about. You all just need to quit trying to be liberals about everything and let the woman do her job. How can we have a man that is more of a criminal then half the people behind bars at the moment be a man that has basically a license to kill under the right circumstances.
To me Gov. did the right thing and in academy misuse of your weapon can result to automatic dismissal, using a taser gun on your 10 year old sun is mis-use of your weapon. Too me this guy just keeps getting away with things all because he is on the otherside of the law. Had it been a person from the public he would be behind bars.
I have a friend that was airport security, maced one of his friends, and is now doing 3 months because the kid couldnt breathe and went into shock.
Im with you big mike all the way.
Let the lady do her job, you voted her in there, stand beside her not against her. You people are just like the bush haters ya he has done some stupid things, but if you had a smarter bit of intelligence then why arnt you sitting in that seat, there are decisions that have to be made and pressure has effect, life moves on. We have to defend ourselves not role on our backs and let us take it in the rear!
guy uses duty taser on kid = guy loses job
shouldn't be much more difficult than that....
how many times has he used his taser in questionable circumstances on the public?
38% of all americans who have been tased have died? Where on earth did you get that info???? Taser has never, ever, been directly linked to a person's death. Do some research and educate yourself please. It makes for a more intelligent dialog.
I like Sara, I hate bush. for ak49lc
What all of many of you seem to be for getting or not understanding is that it would have been ILLEGAL for Monegan to fire Wooten IF Palin had asked him to. Wooten's poor judgment issues had all occurred before Palin and Monegan were in their positions. The issues had been investigated, and Wooten had been punished for them. Please do not take this to mean that I am defending Wooten or that I think he received appropriate punishment for what he did. I'm just saying that just because a new governor and commissioner come on board doesn't mean that they can go back and review all past disciplinary actions, decide if the punishment was appropriate, and "posthumously" increase any punishments that they didn't like. To do so would open the state up to a huge lawsuit for firing an employee for actions that he had already been disciplined for. So for those of you who believe that whether Palin asked Monegan to fire Wooten or not, he should have done what the boss asked, remember that what the boss may have asked him to do was illegal, so that is not valid justification for firing him. So if that wasn't the reason, then why DID he get fired?
Sounds to me like the net effect is that Wooten has a guaranteed job-- Monegan's successor dare not fire him.
chelly - I usually find your comments much to slanted on the side of the police to agree with, but I must say in this instance you are making perfect sense, except for the taser, there is informnation out there that states they are harmful. I suppose if you look long enough on the internet you could find something to back up anything..
See below.
>However, according to the D.O.J., "Arrest-Related Deaths in the United
>States, 2003-2005," which includes a section on deaths involving
>conducted-energy devices (CEDs) such as TASERs. The report concludes
>that CEDs were the cause of death in 17 cases.
>http://www.amnestyusa.org/document.php?lang=e&id=ENGUSA20071011002
>
chelly: Spoken like a true cop... You state, "Taser has never, ever, been directly linked to a person's death." and then you berate someone for not doing enough research, when it is evident that you yourself did little--if any research--and are in dire need of an education.
Seems the link Wendee provided actually does attribute several deaths to a taser and even cnn today has an article where a cop is being charged with a mans death as a direct result of a taser. http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/07/22/tase...
People like you really sicken me.
Bornnbred, as a certified taser instructor (who has been tased at least three times in training), I can say with some authority that there has not been a single incident where the use of a taser has been found to be the cause of death. I read the article you posted, and it shocked me and puzzled me. Shocked at the officer's behavior, and puzzled that the use of the taser in this incident is so strongly linked to his death. However, as is the case in all of these, the only info we have at this point is what has been given to us by the media.
Wendee, I should have responded to you to, but I forgot to read your post while responding. Here are some excerpts from the national institute of justice report.
The potential for moderate or severe injury related to CED exposure is low.
CEDs can produce secondary or indirect effects that may result in death.
There is currently no medical evidence that CEDs pose a significant risk for induced cardiac dysrhythmia when deployed reasonably;
Research shows that human subjects maintain the ability to breathe during exposure to CED;
CED technology may be a contributor to 'stress' when stress is an issue related to cause of death determination;
Excited delirium is one of several terms that describe a syndrome characterized by psychosis and agitation and may be caused by several underlying conditions;
Excited delirium that requires subdual carries with it a high risk of death, regardless of the method of subdual;
Current human research suggests that the use of CED is not a life-threatening stressor in cases of excited delirium beyond the generalized stress of the underlying condition or appropriate subdual;
Please note that these comments are strictly regarding the likelihood of a Taser being the sole or primary cause of serious injury or death, and not about how Trooper Wooten used the Taser, which he was punished for.
I can not get past the fact that a grown man would tazer a child. Maybe as a mother it is BEYOND me how an adult could do that. My children have often asked for things that were wrong for them and illegal to boot! Mom, can I taste that drink? Mom, can i take the car even though i don't have a license, mom, can I keep this gum I didn't buy..... You yank them up and march them to the store and have the clerk embarass the heck out of them! You tell them NO! You say when you are older we will re visit this conversation, as a parent we are supposed to protect our children from what they do not understand... not put them in harms way. No excuses. You can not hold other people accountable for what you are not willing to do yourself.
If I tasered my child, would a job suspension be my only punishment? I think not. Regardless of what my reasoning was for doing it, child services would be called and it is very likely that I would be facing charges of one sort or another.
I find it rather hypocritical that if I did something like this in Palmer, the same troopers that thought it was okay to cover for Wooten would be all too happy to cuff me and drag me to a holding cell.
JAT: I would caution you from making statements like, "there has not been a single incident where the use of a taser has been found to be the cause of death" as that is equally as ignorant as chelly's statements of "never, ever". To make such a claim would imply that you have been keeping records of each and every taser use world wide and could provide usage statistics for our review.
If you wish to get into a debate on the issue and start splitting hairs on the taser's level of involvement in a person's death, then please say so. In the cases that were offered in the report I would ask this, "would the person have died had a taser not been used?" It seems to me the answer is unequivocally, NO--hence the link to tasers.
With respect to your comment on the article, the cop stunned the guy NINE TIMES and all in a span of about three minutes. Why on earth would you be surprised that they think the taser is the cause of death? According to the medical examiner, the guy was still "twitching" after shock six but shock seven put a stop to that. Shock eight and nine were thrown in there for good measure I suppose.
You write it off as bad reporting or perhaps even the media feeding the public fear of tasers and hatred for all cops. Maybe if the police forces in America were as open and honest as you attempt to present, we'd have more information to go on than just what the media presents. However, as is the case with most "groups", they have their secret rituals, cover for each other, etc. and it is quite likely that the public will never know "the rest of the story".
Bornbred and Wendee-
justatrooper is going to have an excuse or justification for anything that the troopers do, or anything anyone alleges...
While trying to come off as Mr. Understanding Trooper, he continues to represent one of the main problems with the troopers.
Trooper Wooten got more than a suspension. If you read the reports, he loved being a Wildlife Trooper 'brown shirt' and they made him switch from that to a 'blue shirt' because of his poor judgment. You also should consider that the Palin Family filed 36 allegations against him and that only two stuck because Wooten was man enough to say "I screwed up" and thought he was going to get fired for it. But as one very smart individual stated earlier, it is not about him or your opinion on what he did or how he was punished. All that is history. What does matter is the fact that Gov. Palin may or may not have used her office for unethical means. I think the public and everyone has the right to know the truth...honest, clear, transparent government...sound familiar?
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